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Topic Subject: Cybers
posted 09-07-02 12:28 PM EDT (US)   
Which cybers are best to use when you're in Nano Age? I always find Zeus are very deadly but they always need a little AA protection and they destroy my gold count.

Hyperion are great for dealing with boats and subs but the seem to be too easily killed by tanks.

Ares are just massacred by fighters.

Pandora and Minotaur seem to do only a limited job against infantry and siege.

Is there a good cyber combo?


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posted 09-07-02 04:19 PM EDT (US)     1 / 15  
Wow...a cherub asking...:|

In my opinion, if youre gonna rush rush with Mino and Pando. If game's advanced situation, use Ares & AA-vehicle or Zeus&Tanks. Pure cybers is not good solution IMO.

I must say I'm not so experienced in Digi & Nano since I hate those ages, but of course in some games the random epoch chose them so I had to learn them.


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posted 09-07-02 07:23 PM EDT (US)     2 / 15  
I am experienced, so i'll educate you.

First things first, pure cybers DOES work with costreduction and build time decrease, with a little help from AA. Hyperions and Zues make a good combo. Hyperions decimate buildings, inf, and tanks when massed, zeus kill those pesky AT and siege. You just need to worry about air.


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posted 09-07-02 07:34 PM EDT (US)     3 / 15  
Cybers should be used mainly as support units. They are too specialized to form the backbone of an army, with the exception of maybe Hyperion. Deciding what mechs to build when is an extremely situation-specific matter.

Usually, they should be built as support units, with your primary army being another unit type. For example, a tank/infantry combo backed up with Zeus and Minotaur. The goal is to always spend as many resources as you're taking in, and in Digital/Nano, when you have gold to burn but no iron, your only options are 1) AT guns, 2) Support infantry (mortars, stingers, medics) and 3) Cybers. Oh, and temple units, but they die extremely quickly in these ages.

Hyperion are the only real general-purpose Cyber...they're the most versatile, which also means that they never excel in any particular area. I only build them when I need their terrain-crossing ability, otherwise a generic tank/infantry combo is more cost-effective.

Ares are basically "raiding units"...they have mobility and they can repair when away from any other friendly units. They're effective against fortifications, citizens, and isolated infantry -- that's about it. On paper, massing a huge group of Ares and throwing them at the enemy is a bad idea, because by this time the enemy will have an AA grid and an air force. However, it works more times than it really should.

If you scout well, you should have a good idea of what units your enemy is using. If you do, then build the necessary Cybers to defeat them. In case you don't know, Pandora beats infantry, Minotaur beats tanks, Zeus beats both AT guns and other Cybers. AT guns beat all landborne cybers except Zeus.

The thing is with the combat cybers, is that their strengths are more defensive than offensive. For example, tanks have a big offensive penalty against Minotaur, but it is hard to take advantage of the Minotaur's offensive bonus against tanks -- the ROF is slow and you have to wait for the missile to travel to the enemy tank. This means that the tanks survive for a while, even when they are theoretically being defeated. This is bad news for any infantry or siege accompanying the army. Pandora is a little better in this regard because it has splash damage.

In a long game you should always have at least a couple Cyber Laboratories. Apollo are the only unit that can heal other Cybers. Tempests get Antimatter Storm, which will wipe out an Ares fleet or an air attack in one blow. If someone is going for all Cybers, build a couple Hades, use Nanovirus on his Cybers, and watch the destruction.

posted 09-07-02 08:46 PM EDT (US)     4 / 15  
try a tempest rush decimates inf and they have that weird ol power that kills units which i don't know how to use
posted 09-08-02 10:50 AM EDT (US)     5 / 15  
Firstly, I'm new to the game so don't expect me to know much.

Secondly my tactic is always, Zeus + Stingers. The stingers knock out any pesky air unit and teh Zeus destroy the rest. But then I hit a problem when my gold runs out. And is it me, or does my gold run out quicker than iron?

The tempest thing decimates any air unit. It's quite funny watching an entire Ares fleet die.


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posted 09-08-02 02:06 PM EDT (US)     6 / 15  
Well, if you concentrate on Zeus and Stingers, then your gold is naturally going to run out because both unit types cost gold. I would recommend using Skywatchers instead of Stingers in most situations unless you absolutely can't afford the iron.

Note that if you build one skywatcher, one tank and two Guardians for each Zeus, you equalize your resource output (280 iron and 280 gold). Also, this combo would fare better against more types of units, though it would still have trouble against a large tank line. Maybe throw some Spectre AT Helicopters into the mix. A plain Zeus/AA combo is going to get smashed by a cheaper force of tanks and/or infantry, because those are the counter units to Zeus.

You should always try to spend your minerals at the same rate you're taking them in. If you have two gold mines and two iron mines, spend equal amounts of both on your units at the same time. If you're stuck with three iron mines and one gold mine, then you'll have to spend three times as much iron as gold -- build more iron-based units. However, I usually try to have equal amounts of both mines under my control at the same time.
______________________________________________

Oh, and I wanted to add that I didn't give Hyperion enough credit in my earlier post. I just played a game against the computer (there weren't any good games online) last night where Hyperions were the only thing that could break the computer's defensive line. They are good, well-rounded offensive units, provided that the cost to mass them isn't an issue. But this is an RTS, so in most situations the cost is always going to be an issue...

[This message has been edited by Blamer (edited 09-08-2002 @ 02:11 PM).]

posted 09-08-02 10:05 PM EDT (US)     7 / 15  
this might sound less sophicated, but I only use ares. The self-healing is a plus, and their only weekness is to planes. My Ares are always upgrades to the max, with civ bonuses too. Before I attack i build 6-8 cyber factories, double clikc and hit the button like 5 times. (yes most of the time my economy will allow it.) Since the range is 9, that means it can defeat AA w.o AA seeing them, same for troops. I guess sskywatchers would defeat the Air attack, but usually i take out his airports, and by the time he is done destroying my first band of ares, i got 30 more coming towards him. Granted, you have to have at least 3 farms improved, and a lot of gold mins (4+). But I deafeated everyone with my ares army.
posted 09-09-02 08:59 PM EDT (US)     8 / 15  
Well, to be perfectly honest, your strategy might work on newbies, but seriously, I always have at least 20 AA towers, and as many or more skywatchers, and if you don't think that that much AA would kill your Ares, you've got another thing coming. Another thing, that I've found is nice, is that I always use Zues, because they're just powerhouses, and they can attack ares, because they're advantage is against cybers. So, this means that any Ares you send against me, can be killed by 8 Zues. (The way I reason this out, is, fully upgraded, Zues have about 75 laser armor, and ares do about 40-50 damage, which means that they do basically 1 damage each shot, where the Zues do about 300-350 damage each shot. The Ares could pea-shoot the Zues all day, and they'd still get their butts handed to them by 8 or less. Now, granted, I don't have as much experience in the Nano Ages, but I do know that more armor than attack = 1 damage each shot. Anyways, I just think that Ares usefulness is highly limited if the target of their attacks has decent AA, and knows what he is doing.
posted 09-10-02 06:14 PM EDT (US)     9 / 15  
yeah, i agree, zeus's are very good against ares, but they cost a lot. I think the ares' number one enemy is planes. regular AA is nothing, skywatchers are a bit of a challenege. If the person was pretty good, (im not too good at the cyber thing, I usually end in modern.) i would probably send over tanks and AT as well as zeus. AT is very good against cybers, except zeus, and tanks and infantry are good against zeus. Thats what I live about EE, always a unit to counter the best unit.
posted 09-11-02 00:35 AM EDT (US)     10 / 15  
I don't play many games past modern, I stop once i reach modern in fact. But I have found that Cybers are just way to expensive to be effective.

AT and AA counter Cybers pretty effectivly cost wise, throw in a few tanks for support and you have an army to beat anything that is post modern.

If the game reaches post modern through other people advancing then i have thiose extra resources that i didnt spend for the Epoch upgrade as well, so im even better off

this is assuming you dont get chance to mass cybers, but in a competitive game that aint gonna happen.

posted 09-11-02 03:40 PM EDT (US)     11 / 15  
I'd use Ares and some air support (fighters or fighter bombers). If you can get it so that you mass Ares, clear an area, send some guys to the other island, build AA first, then Tank Factory for mobile AA. Then you can easily destroy the other's island if micromanaged good enough. If you want to, you could build towers and AA where ever you've conquered.

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posted 09-12-02 02:31 PM EDT (US)     12 / 15  
Albion, I usually do not like games past modern, but you cannot refuse to upgrade. even if you do not use the Cybers, the other upgrades in modern are worth it. The tanks, airplanes, AA, AT, naval, is all more powerful. It would be very unwise to not upgrade. And as for economy, by the time I get to nano, I have such a great economy, I can afford to upgrade and produce 30 cybers.
posted 09-12-02 03:56 PM EDT (US)     13 / 15  
I guess Zeus is a no-no and so are most cybers.

CenturionZ_1
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posted 09-12-02 04:56 PM EDT (US)     14 / 15  
dont use just one thing. use a varation.

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posted 09-13-02 05:46 AM EDT (US)     15 / 15  
Omega, sorry didnt make myself too clear there, I would rather spend the resources on increasing military size rather than going up an epoch. Once resources become availabale of course it is wise to move up and upgrade, but i still concentrate my army around convetional weapons (non cyber).
I have seen too many games using on Random epo, that start in modern and some people rush out to move up an epoch at the expense of their military. Other than the jump from middle, and the jump to WW1, the advantages in moving up an epoch are far outwayed by staying in the lower Epoch and building your military (Size and upgrades), provided of course that you use it.
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